I read that Richard Dawkin interested in running an atheist school so I thought that the following ethics and values for atheist school should be considered

Versions of the ten secular commandments

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_Comman ... ternatives
http://tellapallet.com/ten_commandments.htm
http://www.thecodeforglobalethics.com/p ... e877a.html
http://www.webspawner.com/users/humanist10/
http://www.globalideasbank.org/site/ban ... deaId=2963
http://www.iamanatheist.com/rights.html


Secular graces

http://humgroups.humanist.org.uk/Grace.html
http://www.secularseasons.org/celebrations/graces.html
http://www.churchoffreethought.org/inde ... &Itemid=84


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The Affirmations of Humanism:
A Statement of Principles
http://www.secularhumanism.org/index.ph ... firmations
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The Ethics of Humanism Without Religion
by Paul Kurtz

http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/ ... 23_1_1.htm

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The Core Principles
of Secular Humanism
Twelve Fundamental Principles
Stated and Examined
by Victor A. Gunasekara

http://uqconnect.net/slsoc/manussa/coreprin.htm


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NEO-HUMANIST STATEMENT
OF SECULAR PRINCIPLES AND VALUES:
PERSONAL, PROGRESSIVE, AND PLANETARY

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FRIENDSHIP Featured at May 2010 Service
Written by Administrator http://www.churchoffreethought.org/

1. TRUST (We need to be able to trust and to be loyal to our friends.)
2. HONESTY (Tactful honesty is a foundation of friendship!)
3. RESPECT (We honour our disagreements as well as our agreements and respect healthy boundaries.)
4. ACCEPTANCE (We want to “be ourselves” with our friends and accept our friends for who they are as well.)
5. SHARED INTERESTS (It makes it easier to have friends when we can do things together.)
6. SHARED VALUES (The most solid friendships depend on similar core values.)
7. COOPERATION (Friendships depend on a certain level of working together to foster and support the friendship and its needs.)
8. RELIABILITY (Friends rely on each other so friends need to be dependable.)
9. SUPPORT (As Mark Twain put it, we want friends that can defend us when we’re in the wrong since nearly everyone will defend us when we’re in the right!)
10. UNDERSTANDING (Most people would rather be understood even more than agreed with.)
11. SENSITIVITY (Friends who know us can often know how we are feeling.)
12. RECIPROCITY (What we expect or do with or for our friends is what is expected of us.)
13. ABILITY TO COMPROMISE (Friends are willing to “give in” at times and let the other person have something their way.)
14. SENSE OF EQUALITY (It is hard to have a real friendship with someone that we are either responsible to or for. This is why it doesn’t work out well for a parent to try to be “best friends” with their child(ren).)
15. FORGIVENESS (Too much to say about this! And even with friends forgiving is not the same as forgetting or even setting ourselves up for another cause for forgiveness.)

Thanks for all those links, coffee, lots of reading there!

I had been trying to (re)find the "Affirmations of Humanism ... ..." one for some time, I needed it on another forum but could not remember it!

I think that there is some tautology there and it seems to miss the desire that all humans should be allowed and aided to develop their natural aptitudes to the fullest extent.


Now, is atheism directly synonymous with Humanism? I don't think it is. As many theists love to point out atheism has included some pretty nasty people and regimes (though they always get Hitler and Mussolini wrong!) Humanism can be described as a belief system and though humanist schools would not be "faith schools" as the term "faith" is used in this context they could come perilously close - unless they allowed those with a natural inclination towards a spiritualistic belief the chance to develop as well.

"Secular schools" sounds better, but many would claim that all state schools are secular, even though an act of worship is required and truly balanced comparative "belief education" is rarely offered.

Choosing a school for children always seems to be something of a compromise for the truly thinking parent/guardian. Someone said that an atheist school was not possible for there may be as many types of atheist as there are atheists - and not all such subscribe to the tenets listed in the "Affirmation".

But, this still supposes that parents/guardians will do the choosing - what about the child's rights of decision? Is "pushing" one's child into a Humanist school close to a Catholic pushing theirs into a "faith school"? But children are not qualified to make their own decisions.

I will watch with great interest to see how this idea develops.

I would say yes to secular schools - in fact I believe all schools should be secular; and, of course, many are - more or less.

I don't see why it's necessary to mimic religious models. If grace is not appropriate, which obviously it wouldn't be in a secular school, then get rid of it. Same for the commandments. Ok, if it's a bit of fun then fine, but isn't the entire point that there is no commander, we are not being commanded. This is exactly the sort of model we should be trying to discourage. There are better ways to teach values and ethics, in my opinion.

Naturally I am also wholeheartedly in favour of secular schooling for our children.

I subscribe to Dawkin's idea to set up secular schools, especially if we (BHA) cannot win over the academies' governmental project.

Quite.
Our children don't need commandments that they can passively follow, they need to learn the skills of critical thinking to be able to actively carve their own furrows.

^^ yes - what Manuel and Fia said ^^

Thank you all very much for yours views.

What Dawkins actually said, during his mumsnet appearance (http://bit.ly/bx30jc, is this:



I'm a secularist. That means I'm against state-funded atheist schools just as much as I am against state-funded religious schools. I'm not sure whether "atheist free school" means a state-funded one or a private but no-fees one.

Dan

I think he meant "in the frame of the academies' project.

With deeper hindsight I think that the negative aspect of this academies project can turn out to be a substantial opportunity for the Humanist cause to demonstrate the validity of the evolutionist method in fostering an open mind in children.
Religions invest in sumptuous cathedrals; we Humanists instead, can decide to invest in children intelligent education

Hmmm....I can't see how an education can exclude the question of whether there is a god. And as there isn't, then education must say so or it is not being honest. Why should we atheists hold our tongues? Especially when we are right?

Where have you found a private but no fees school? It means state-funded or more accurately, tax-payer funded.

As an atheist, I'd love to know what your knock-down proof of the non-existence of a creative deity is.
Whether we are right or not, and I think we are, I think there is still room for reasonable doubt on the question. In other words, while I don't think there is a God, and I think I can justify that position, I don't think you can say that no reasonable person can disagree. That being so, it is definitely not on - on secularist principle - for the state to sponsor a position.

Education can include discussion of the topic, of course. It's not about "atheists holding their tongues", it's about what the State should do.

I asked about the "free school", as I was used to the term in anarchist educational writings. But I see it is used by the government, and so does indeed refer to state-funded schools.

DAn

Hmmm.... It's about what is the most likely working hypothosis (to borrow from TubaTD). The religious don't spot the irony in their demand for respect and the propmotion of their myths.