INFORMATION

This website uses cookies to store information on your computer. Some of these cookies are essential to make our site work and others help us to improve by giving us some insight into how the site is being used. For further information, see our Privacy Policy. Continuing to use this website is acceptance of these cookies.

Complementary therapies

Any topic related to science can be discussed here.
Post Reply
Message
Author
Maria Mac
Site Admin
Posts: 9302
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:34 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#81 Post by Maria Mac » March 17th, 2008, 10:09 am

Latest post of the previous page:

The delightful Professor Kathy Sykes is doing another series on Alternative Therapies beginning tonight on BBC2 at 9 pm. The first one is on hypnotherapy. I saw her interviewed on breakfast TV this morning and it seems she was quite impressed with what she saw and lamented that she didn't have the "gift" of suggestibility that those who've used hypnotherapy to turn their lives around have.

Lucretius
Posts: 262
Joined: July 26th, 2007, 11:19 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#82 Post by Lucretius » March 17th, 2008, 4:15 pm

Cringe.
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats." - H.L. Mencken

User avatar
Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#83 Post by Alan H » March 17th, 2008, 8:28 pm

Maria wrote:The delightful Professor Kathy Sykes is doing another series on Alternative Therapies beginning tonight on BBC2 at 9 pm.
Oh! I suppose I'll have to watch it. Who's the presenter again? Oh! Kathy Sykes.

Image
:love:
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Lucretius
Posts: 262
Joined: July 26th, 2007, 11:19 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#84 Post by Lucretius » March 17th, 2008, 9:02 pm

I would.


That doesn't necessarily mean she has any positive attributes though.

:redface:
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats." - H.L. Mencken

Nick
Posts: 11027
Joined: July 4th, 2007, 10:10 am

Re: Complementary therapies

#85 Post by Nick » March 20th, 2008, 12:37 pm

How was it Alan? I missed it as I was out. I have seen hypnosis in action, and though of coure it is open to abuse, there is something going on, unlike homoeopathy for example.

User avatar
Emma Woolgatherer
Posts: 2976
Joined: February 27th, 2008, 12:17 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#86 Post by Emma Woolgatherer » March 20th, 2008, 1:41 pm

I found the programme quite interesting, but disappointing. The camera spent far too much time lingering lovingly over Prof. Sykes's sun-kissed skin, and recording her somewhat disjointed musings. And I didn't think a strong enough distinction was made between the scientific evaluation of hypnosis and what the vast majority of people get when they go to see a hypnotherapist or clinical hypnotist for a particular problem. After all, it's not a regulated profession. Anybody can do a short course and set up as a practitioner. That's not to say that they're all a bunch of charlatans, but I suspect that, like a lot of alternative therapists, the practitioners remember, and exaggerate, their "successes", and explain away their failures.

I did have a session with a clinical hypnotist once. It was ... interesting. It wasn't at all effective, but that didn't bother me; I hadn't really expected it to be effective. I'd gone out of curiosity. What bothered me was that the hypnotist was so sure that he had hypnotised me, when I didn't think he had. I expressed my scepticism, pointed out that I hadn't been at all relaxed, in fact had been extremely tense throughout the session. Oh no, he said, that's one of the misconceptions about hypnosis. It has nothing to do with relaxation. Hmmm. Well, that's certainly not the impression I got from the BBC2 programme.

Anyway, I shall watch the next in the series. But if it focuses quite so much, and so obviously, on the undeniable charms of its presenter, I might not be able to keep watching.

Emma

User avatar
Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#87 Post by Alan H » March 21st, 2008, 4:30 pm

Emma W wrote:The camera spent far too much time lingering lovingly over Prof. Sykes's sun-kissed skin
on the undeniable charms of its presenter
...and your problem is???? :D

Anyway, I found it a bit better than her previous outing (last year) where she 'investigated' acupuncture. She showed an open-heart operation in China, performed with just acupuncture and a local anaesthetic, but the latter got lost a bit in the dialogue. The next day, in the Herald, the writer of an article obviously missed that bit and said the whole operation was carried out only with acupuncture!

This last programme was definitely better and did try to explain the scientific method, so in that respect, it was at least a step in the right direction. The tooth extraction was very interesting, but may have been less impressive that it looked.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

kbell
Posts: 1146
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 11:27 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#88 Post by kbell » March 28th, 2008, 2:51 am

Has the second one been on yet?
Kathryn

User avatar
Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#89 Post by Alan H » March 28th, 2008, 9:37 am

It looks like the second on on reflexology was on in England and Wales last Monday, but it will be on BBC Scotland next Monday :shrug:
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Maria Mac
Site Admin
Posts: 9302
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:34 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#90 Post by Maria Mac » March 31st, 2008, 6:45 pm

Yes, it's showing in Scotland tonight at 9 pm.

In the meantime, enjoy this totally gratuitous pic that has nothing whatever to do with the programme.

Image

:love:

User avatar
Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#91 Post by Alan H » March 31st, 2008, 8:48 pm

:sick:
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

User avatar
Emma Woolgatherer
Posts: 2976
Joined: February 27th, 2008, 12:17 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#92 Post by Emma Woolgatherer » April 1st, 2008, 12:45 am

I missed the third one on meditation shown tonight (in England), but my partner watched it and said it was very good, quite apart from the presenter being "a hottie". :cross:

Lucretius
Posts: 262
Joined: July 26th, 2007, 11:19 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#93 Post by Lucretius » April 1st, 2008, 1:33 am

http://www.weirdscience.com

It proves that all complementary medicine has 100% efficacy.

Or this could be an April fools.
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats." - H.L. Mencken

User avatar
Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#94 Post by Alan H » April 1st, 2008, 8:00 am

Emma W wrote:quite apart from the presenter being "a hottie". :cross:
Another red-blooded male, then? (I don't know who the old guy with the curly wig that Maria posted is, though.)
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Felicia
Posts: 495
Joined: August 3rd, 2007, 9:16 am

Re: Complementary therapies

#95 Post by Felicia » April 1st, 2008, 10:30 am

I too thought the one on meditation was interesting: the conclusion, that meditation may make people happier, more balanced etc is one that resonates with my own experience. The other claims, that it can affect cardio-vascular states, asthma, even diabetes, were not substantiated, but as K said, there were no scientific tests with only one or two variables.

My interest in all these programmes is that what seems to be emerging (surprise, surprise) is the huge, complicated and almost unknown interrelation between mind and body. I know there are a few studies on the placebo effect, but really I feel scientists ought to be devoting their time to this - after all, all these alternative therapies depend on it billions of pounds are spent in the alternative therapy industry, people lose their lives (I know a woman who refused conventional treatment for her breast cancer, did homeopathy and diet things and died, leaving two small children).
Its the waste that irritates me, especially when there is this fascinating area of knowledge to be explored. If I were younger and scientifically inclined, that's what I'd be doing.

mdean
Posts: 26
Joined: February 27th, 2008, 4:56 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#96 Post by mdean » April 1st, 2008, 5:09 pm

The problem is the funding. Unless you have a product to sell, preferably at a large profit, the private sector is understandably uninterested. To be able to convince anyone that public funds should be spend requires the evidence that it is potentially useful - catch 22. A large political will can do it but you need a convincing argument that your chosen field is a sure fire vote winner - in this country most research into complementary therapy is sired by the 'Charlie effect', putting off most politicians.

User avatar
Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#97 Post by Alan H » April 1st, 2008, 11:49 pm

I have just watched (while I was working on my PC) the meditation episode on the BBC's website (although I'll watch it again next Monday). She seems to be doing the same here as she did on the last one: she does say that there is no evidence for reflexology (although a massage is very nice) and certainly no way that it could work by the explanations reflexologists give and similarly disses the 'explanations' of how meditation works, but she then goes on (frequently quoting from research not yet published and hence not completed or peer reviewed) that gives the impression that there may well be an explanation for how they 'work' [---][/---] it's just that scientists haven't found or understood it yet. I suspect (double blind, randomised trial needed here) that many will come away with the impression that these things do work and backed up [---][/---] at least partially [---][/---] by science.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Lucretius
Posts: 262
Joined: July 26th, 2007, 11:19 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#98 Post by Lucretius » April 2nd, 2008, 5:38 am

Human beings are social creatures that enjoy physical contact with each other. The bonding effects of this contact creates social cohesion between individuals. It isn't difficult to understand why a massage would make you feel good.
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats." - H.L. Mencken

User avatar
jaywhat
Posts: 15807
Joined: July 5th, 2007, 5:53 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#99 Post by jaywhat » April 2nd, 2008, 5:48 am

Talking to your goldfish is just as good, but would you tell anyone about it let alone try and sell the idea?

Lucretius
Posts: 262
Joined: July 26th, 2007, 11:19 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#100 Post by Lucretius » April 2nd, 2008, 5:56 am

Talking to a goldfish is not as good as getting a massage.
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats." - H.L. Mencken

mdean
Posts: 26
Joined: February 27th, 2008, 4:56 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#101 Post by mdean » April 2nd, 2008, 10:48 am

N.B. very important that the two are not mixed up as giving or getting a massage is very bad for goldfish.

Post Reply