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Hifi firms have been ripping me off

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coffee
Posts: 1586
Joined: June 2nd, 2009, 4:53 pm

Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#1 Post by coffee » August 11th, 2015, 9:36 am

Watch out, Hi Fi firms are deliberately DESIGN imperfect sound systems to keep you SPENDING
MORE for good sound. It's a RIP-OFF.


They deliberately design, and shifting bad audio frequency to different part of the audio
frequency spectrum to different speakers, as a result, different hi fi speakers sound good
with certain music and bad with others, another words, all speakers good at certain music
but bad at others. They will never make speakers that sound good with all/type music because
people will never buy another speakers for a long time because that would be bad business for them.


And that also apply to other hifi gears too like cd players, amplifiers etc. the more you
pay for hifi gears the more you fund their research how to fiddle/(design) with the hifi
audio sound "better", so you will never get a perfect sound. Only those that prepare to pay
an enormous amount of money will get a decent hifi gears.

They also blame the cd/music when their hi fi gears sound bad. I used to spend thousand of
pounds and still not getting the sound for the money. the hifi industry were milking me,
back up by the hifi magazines review which i was foolishly followed their review. I am now
very bitter about it :( I don't want wanna see other people to go through the same experience as I did.

I am now keep my spending below £50 for micro hifi and never more than £100, so if i do make
mistake about the sound, i don't have too much to regret.

Does it make sense?
Now you know their tricks and know how to avoid it.

They (hifi firms) are now moving their activities to headfones market now because youngster
using mp3 players. So be careful if your kid want headfones that cost hundreds of pounds.

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Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#2 Post by Alan H » August 11th, 2015, 10:44 am

There are several problems with the hifi industry. One is that at the top end, it is rife with pseudo science and quackery - just like alt med.

Another issue is that, unless you listen to purely acoustic musing (orchestra's etc), there is no such thing as 'perfect sound': it all depends on how it is mixed and controlled before being turned into CDs/MP3s/etc. If a piece of music is recorded with, say, one range of frequencies enhanced or with the vocals subdued because the producer thought that sounded better, then that's what you'll get. If the producer is crap at their job, then you will get crap sound. But there is no perfect sound for a non-acoustic source - just what the producer decided it should sound like.

These days, essentially what the producer produces is what you get out of the CD/mp3. Long gone are the days where the playback equipment determined the sound quality and you needed a Linn Sondeck turntable to hear the 'authentic' sound! The manufacturer can cut back on quality in the audio amplifier (and producing a really high quality amp is not entirely trivial even though there are many off-the-shelf solutions that will provide more than adequate quality for the vast majority of us) but the main influence on what you hear are the speakers and the room they are in. Even if you have a good quality amplifier that faithfully reproduces what it is given from the CD/mp3 and a pair of high quality speakers, the room you put them in can dramatically affect what your ears actually hear. Some hifi enthusiasts will try to alter the room acoustics to get a 'better' sound, but many of them are classical music listeners - that's fine as far as it goes, but if you want a realistic sound of an orchestra performing in the Albert Hall, you need to go to the Albert Hall! Even though there are some things you can do, the majority of us are essentially stuck with what we have in the way of room furnishings and curtains and don't have many options for speaker placement!
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

coffee
Posts: 1586
Joined: June 2nd, 2009, 4:53 pm

Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#3 Post by coffee » August 13th, 2015, 9:25 am

Hi Alan,

There is truth in what you say. However, when my friend played the same cd on his a £30 cd player compare to a thousand pounds system that I have, and sound almost as good and sometimes even better, I know I had been had! Ok it is not as loud, but it is very listenable £30 cd player.

My thousand pounds system is now a bewtiful piece of furniture and nothing more. Sometimes I am thinking what I could have done with a thousand pounds, quite a lot of useful things in fact, and I have learn it the hard way.

With speakers, they design it so that some part of the audio spectrum sound really good and the other parts sound boxy or plastically (rubbish), but the good parts sound just enough to get you over the paywall while you in their shop (HI FI shops), by the time you get the speakers home then you would

have more time with it, you will discover then that with some of your favourites songs, it may sometimmes sound flat, or plastically, boxy or incoherent (lack definition in the sound, not three dimensional, lack separation of intruments and voices), inconsistent, erratic, muffle. it could be too late by then, unless you still got the original box and wrapping of the speakers to take it back (if they would except it back).

I now have a dab system cost below £50 that consistently deliver a listenable music and speech which make me very happy!

I will never go back to hi fi separates or any expensive hifi stuff.

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Alan H
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Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#4 Post by Alan H » August 13th, 2015, 9:46 am

coffee wrote:Hi Alan,

There is truth in what you say. However, when my friend played the same cd on his a £30 cd player compare to a thousand pounds system that I have, and sound almost as good and sometimes even better, I know I had been had! Ok it is not as loud, but it is very listenable £30 cd player.
That was essentially the point I was making: there can be crap £30 systems, however, but many will be reasonable quality. Speakers on the other hand are not so easy to get right (and the room acoustics influence the sound a lot). A saving feature is that many systems have various enhancements (much more than just a graphic equaliser) that will alter the sound that may give you something you like.

But there are many people who can pick out far more detail and nuance in music than the rest of us: they are the ones who perhaps need to spend a bit more than £30!
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

coffee
Posts: 1586
Joined: June 2nd, 2009, 4:53 pm

Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#5 Post by coffee » August 13th, 2015, 10:08 am

But there are many people who can pick out far more detail and nuance in music than the rest of us: they are the ones who perhaps need to spend a bit more than £30!
I agree with you Alan, but be careful though, especially if your money is tight.

coffee
Posts: 1586
Joined: June 2nd, 2009, 4:53 pm

Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#6 Post by coffee » August 15th, 2015, 9:16 am

The speaker flaws that I mentioned are not accidental or unavoidable, they are deliberately introduce to to the lower price range speakers to encourage you to spend more

for a higher price range speakers to get a better sound, but of course they also introduce others flaws to this higher price range to encourage you to spend even higher higher price range speaker and so it it goes on until you run out of change. It the tricks of hi fi firms

trade, they deliberately design to milk you. so make sure when spending your money for good sound, is to spend what you are comfortable with your money and not chase for a perfect

sound because that would be very expensive and there is no guarantee that you will get it.

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Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#7 Post by Alan H » August 15th, 2015, 11:28 am

coffee wrote:The speaker flaws that I mentioned are not accidental or unavoidable, they are deliberately introduce to to the lower price range speakers to encourage you to spend more

for a higher price range speakers to get a better sound, but of course they also introduce others flaws to this higher price range to encourage you to spend even higher higher price range speaker and so it it goes on until you run out of change. It the tricks of hi fi firms

trade, they deliberately design to milk you. so make sure when spending your money for good sound, is to spend what you are comfortable with your money and not chase for a perfect

sound because that would be very expensive and there is no guarantee that you will get it.
I'm not convinced, coffee. I've no doubt that some higher-priced speakers are better and may well be 'over-priced', but what's the evidence that they deliberately introduce flaws, and what flaws?
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

coffee
Posts: 1586
Joined: June 2nd, 2009, 4:53 pm

Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#8 Post by coffee » August 17th, 2015, 9:23 am

but what's the evidence that they deliberately introduce flaws, and what flaws?
Because there aspects of expensive speaker that you would expect no flaw in expensive speaker but they have, why? because when I played the cd on inexpensive micro hi fi show that it it didn't exist. I don't expect cheap micro hi fi to be perfect but when there is no flaw on cheap mico hi fi that showed up in expensive speakers.

I over the 15 years have five pairs of speakers, 3 cd players, 3 amplifiers, 4 dab radios I can compare and contrast them. I have some electronic background and intuition and I am trained as analyst so I can work it out.

I you don't believe me, you can spend a couple thousand pounds on hi fi system then you will be able to work it out yourself too.

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Altfish
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Joined: March 26th, 2012, 8:46 am

Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#9 Post by Altfish » August 17th, 2015, 12:43 pm

I think my ears are shot! Too many loud punk concerts and the like.

I cannot tell good hi-fi from average hi-fi from top of the range hi-fi; so I believe that if I buy a middle of the range system it'll be good enough for me.

To be honest much of the music I like is better sounding 'raw'. I can't imaging The Stooges 'I Wanna be your Dog" on a top of the range hi-fi.

coffee
Posts: 1586
Joined: June 2nd, 2009, 4:53 pm

Re: Hifi firms have been ripping me off

#10 Post by coffee » August 18th, 2015, 9:16 am

Regarding to music, I like a bit of everything

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