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Humanism, religion and charity

For topics that are more about faith, religion and religious organisations than anything else.
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Alan H
Posts: 24067
Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#21 Post by Alan H » September 10th, 2010, 7:20 pm

Latest post of the previous page:

Dave B wrote:Thanks for the link, Vicky. I donated via the Disaster Emergency Committee. Though I know that this includes Christian Aid, CAFOD, Islamic Relief and Tearfund I thought it the best chance that my money would be used effectively. I will bookmark the link you gave for future donations.
I donated directly to the British Red Cross - gets round the problem!
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Daniel P
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Joined: March 30th, 2009, 12:38 pm

Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#22 Post by Daniel P » September 10th, 2010, 7:34 pm

Vicky wrote:
Apparently, before the shoeboxes are sent off, each box is opened and a Christian tract inserted (those poor children need SAVING!). They don't tell the donors that! The charity is called "Samaritan's Purse" and the Christmas effort is called "Operation Christmas Child".

Vicky
Thanks for letting us know that.

There is a Christian charity here in Fareham that organize shoe boxes for deprived Eastern European children too. I don't remember if it's the same one you're talking about, and I've never given to them, but I liked what they said in their tract and I would never have thought there might be a problem! If I ever think of giving to them, I'll investigate first.

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Alan H
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#23 Post by Alan H » October 1st, 2010, 12:30 pm

How about a real Easter egg next year? All proceeds to a good cause. Well, the C of E, anyway.

'Christian' Easter eggs snubbed by stores claims Church Of England
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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Dave B
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#24 Post by Dave B » October 1st, 2010, 5:53 pm

I think that is fair enough, surely Easter eggs have nowt to do with Christianity anyway. Even Easter is named after a pagan goddess! Hmm, wonder if there is a market for a version that has pagan ritualistic symbols or something on it? Would the supermarkets carry that I wonder?

No, doubt it! Never see Diwali sweets in Tescos do you, so why Christian orientated stuff? Hang on, is not the Yule Log a pagan thing?

BAN THE YULE LOG, PAGANS OUT!!! :laughter:
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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Alan H
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#25 Post by Alan H » October 2nd, 2010, 11:03 am

Dave B wrote:No, doubt it! Never see Diwali sweets in Tescos do you
Well, I'm sure I'm sure I've seen Hindu/Muslim items in Sainsbury's at the end of some festival or other. Mind you, it is a very diverse community around here!
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Nick
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Joined: July 4th, 2007, 10:10 am

Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#26 Post by Nick » October 2nd, 2010, 11:37 am

Waitrose has a kosher section. I don't know about other supermarkets but I don't remember seeing them elsewhere....

Gottard
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#27 Post by Gottard » October 2nd, 2010, 4:14 pm

This discussion pushes me to figure out a slogan: religion is divisive even inside supermarkets!
The only thing I fear of death is regret if I couldn’t complete my learning experience

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Val
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#28 Post by Val » October 2nd, 2010, 8:13 pm

Sainsbury in Alwoodley Leeds has a large kosher section. In less politically correct times Alwoodley used to be known as Allyidley.

Marian
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#29 Post by Marian » October 3rd, 2010, 4:09 pm

I'm sorry but cannot ban the Yule log. Why? Because it is the only reason why I eat dinner on December 24 and that is to have dessert. Chocolate yule log rocks! It's all about chocolate. :)

Our supermarkets tend to cater to the highest population group in that district but they've got a huge variety of what's called 'ethnic' foods. In one area, where the asian population is the predominant group, they've got shelves and shelves of all things asian but they also have smaller sections that carry: Mexican, Halal, Kosher etc. Everybody shops there anyway so they might was well carry variety.
It is also possible to travel to different parts of the city where you're more likely to find things like: West Indian food, Greek, Italian, Vietnamese, Chinese and that's not even coming close to exhausting the list. What an amazing city I live in. You all must come and visit. It's like having a taste of the world at your doorstep.
Transformative fire...

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Dave B
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#30 Post by Dave B » October 3rd, 2010, 4:27 pm

Yes, we have a good selection in Gloucester also once you look for them. But I am still looking for a place that sells a really hot pepperoni pizza!

Tescos used to do a pepperoni where, I swear, its red colour came from the actual heat rather than the chilli spices! Red hot indeed. Then, being Tesco, they stopped selling it and now sell a bland pink gunge ready sliced in plastic instead.

Then they stopped stocking the one brand of ready made pepperoni pizza. I wonder if I am the only person in this town that likes eating things that steam and fizzle before you even get them in the pan?
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

Gottard
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#31 Post by Gottard » October 3rd, 2010, 5:51 pm

Dave B wrote: I wonder if I am the only person in this town that likes eating things that steam and fizzle before you even get them in the pan?
Zighiny (hot pepper powder) in northern Africa. Not sure of its spelling!
The only thing I fear of death is regret if I couldn’t complete my learning experience

stevenw888
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#32 Post by stevenw888 » May 24th, 2012, 3:16 pm

Are charities necessarily carrying out good work? Here's an article that calls that into question...

http://www.stirringtroubleinternational ... charities/


The only charities I give to are local Birmingham based ones...
"There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old, bold pilots." - From the film "Top Gun"

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Dave B
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#33 Post by Dave B » May 24th, 2012, 4:17 pm

That is one of the big problems with charities working abroad and has been for many year. One of the reasons that I omainly give to the larger ones.

There was evidence some time ago of "competition" betweens middling groups. The more they apparently did the better funding they got from official sources. Unfortunately in some cases there was a large "presence" but little actual work being done. There were results of more funds going into the hotel bills etc. than into the projects.

It has become also an industry it often seems to me. I am happy to support organisations like those who collect, refurbish and distribute tools - happy to offer the tools and a bit of cash towards the processing of them. But that was a one of, don't have a steady supply of tools to offer!

It is often difficult knowing just how to use any spare money reliably. For the moment I am concentrating on the BHF and the NSPCC.
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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Emma Woolgatherer
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#34 Post by Emma Woolgatherer » May 24th, 2012, 5:28 pm

stevenw888 wrote:Are charities necessarily carrying out good work? Here's an article that calls that into question...

http://www.stirringtroubleinternational ... charities/
I think it's pretty obvious than charities aren't all necessarily carrying out good work. Some, I've no doubt, manage to make things worse. But it's a bit of a leap from that to the conclusion that none of them carries out good work, or that charity in general doesn't achieve anything. And there's the much bigger issue of international aid. Not just the kind provided by NGOs, but the kind provided by governments, and by international organisations like the various UN agencies. The whole business needs better scrutiny, better accountability, better measures of effectiveness.

But this blogger nails his political colours to the mast when he concludes:
The thing is that charity has long ago turned into big business, because the whole premises of some good intentioned people raising huge amounts of money without any scrutiny projected on them is just perverse. In the past it was the Church that was helping the poor and the needy and the sick and whatever you think about religion, priests in their vast majority are not interested in money or self-promotion, unlike all those charities. But once the whole activity was snatched from the Church, it all became more progressive and liberal and leftish. And when liberals and progressive get into the frame, expect misuse of funds and personal enrichment to feature prominently on the horizon – and well beyond it.
A totally unsupported claim (that liberals and progressives are more likely to misuse funds and enrich themselves than conservatives and religionists), and one that leaves little old progressive and liberal and leftish me inclined to ignore this blogger altogether, even though I agree with many of his points. I support an anti-poverty NGO called ActionAid, which is probably as progressive and liberal and leftish as they come. In 2008, they published a ten-point plan for aid reform, entitled "Making aid accountable and effective", which I think tackles some of the issues the blogger raises. I think that's a much more useful approach than his kind of cynicism.
stevenw888 wrote:The only charities I give to are local Birmingham based ones...
Any particular reason?

Emma

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Tetenterre
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#35 Post by Tetenterre » May 25th, 2012, 8:57 am

Emma Woolgatherer wrote: But it's a bit of a leap from that to the conclusion that none of them carries out good work, or that charity in general doesn't achieve anything.
I agree. One of the two charities I actively support is the RNLI. I think it would be a disaster if it became reliant on the government to fund it. The other one is MSF which has been doing what I consider to be outstanding work in difficult conditions for decades and which, after the Sri Lankan tsunami, had the moral integrity to ask people to stop donating to it and send the donations elsewhere once it had sufficient financial resources to do all it was capable of.
Steve

Quantum Theory: The branch of science with which people who know absolutely sod all about quantum theory can explain anything.

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Dave B
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#36 Post by Dave B » May 25th, 2012, 9:29 am

Of all the global charities MSF is high on my list of "Most Respected"
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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Alan H
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#37 Post by Alan H » May 25th, 2012, 9:58 am

Tetenterre wrote:
Emma Woolgatherer wrote: But it's a bit of a leap from that to the conclusion that none of them carries out good work, or that charity in general doesn't achieve anything.
I agree. One of the two charities I actively support is the RNLI. I think it would be a disaster if it became reliant on the government to fund it.
Just imagine it: "These are difficult times and we must make tough decisions. The last Government caused all this and we have to tidy up the mess. Difficult decisions have to be made, but we recognise the importance of the service provided by the brave men and women of the RNLI. So, in real terms, we're providing them with additional resources so they can carry on with their sterling work. I'm sure we can all appreciate that the new rowing boats we're delivering - and the new sponsorship deal with Birds Eye - will be welcomed by all."
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

Fia
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#38 Post by Fia » May 25th, 2012, 11:06 am

:pointlaugh: Rowing boats? Surely they can only afford 1 :D

Nick
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#39 Post by Nick » May 25th, 2012, 5:19 pm

MSF? Are you referring to Medicins Sans Frontieres?

I like them too.

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Tetenterre
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#40 Post by Tetenterre » May 25th, 2012, 5:27 pm

Nick wrote:MSF? Are you referring to Medicins Sans Frontieres?
Yup.
Steve

Quantum Theory: The branch of science with which people who know absolutely sod all about quantum theory can explain anything.

Nick
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Re: Humanism, religion and charity

#41 Post by Nick » May 25th, 2012, 5:35 pm

Frankly, Steven, I'm not going to pay too much attention to this article, when the objective of the site is:
First of all, the whole idea behind this particular website is to upset as many people as possible
So, no proper examination of the problems raised or solutions proposed.

Assertions are made without evidence, and causes claimed without reason. For example:
But no, things today are as bad in Africa as thirty years ago. Some even say that they got worse these days.
This is factually wrong. Very wrong. SInce 1995 growth in Africa has been pretty amazing. Six out of the top ten fastest growing countries in the world last year were in Africa. No, I don't think the article is worth reading, even if there are questions to be asked.
Emma Woolgatherer wrote:I think it's pretty obvious than charities aren't all necessarily carrying out good work. Some, I've no doubt, manage to make things worse.
...as is true of governments too. The world is far from perfect.
But it's a bit of a leap from that to the conclusion that none of them carries out good work, or that charity in general doesn't achieve anything. And there's the much bigger issue of international aid. Not just the kind provided by NGOs, but the kind provided by governments, and by international organisations like the various UN agencies. The whole business needs better scrutiny, better accountability, better measures of effectiveness.
More required is an end to corruption and beggar thy neighbour policies by the foreign governments.

There are certainly things wrong with charities, (including Oxfam, of which I am an active supporter), but I'm not going to waste any more time on this pretty facile blog

Oh, and thanks Tetenterre. :)

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